Cozzie wrote: ↑Sat May 10, 2025 5:48 pm
You can get both though?
Surely there's someone out there who can get 10 in a season but can at the very least do the basics of trapping a football.
Play to his strengths then fine, but get him to play with his back to goal and it's at the detriment of the team.
Absolutely no link up play what so ever with him.
If we can make our money back then we need to be taking it.
Maybe this is a mute point because even if he stays he is unlikely, at least I would hope, going to be our starting striker anyway.
If the Leeds offer is genuine we can take it and reinvest so much better.
I don't really go with the premise he's totally useless outside of scoring. However, that said, my point is barring a large offer we need to show we can replace with better first. A good all around striker that can do well at everything is likely going to be very expensive, and can we attract them if so given our recent years and the seeming dearth of strikers out there which has lead to more competition for these players?
IF we can improve on any of our players, that's always what the club should do...I just need to see it happen first before we give up on a player who can score goals.
We also almost certainly are replacing DCL too, so it's a big ask to replace both in one window. I'd rather focus on the DCL replacement and add more goals to the midfield before getting to other players who can do a job still.
Top scorer in a team that for large parts of the season played a system that didn't suit him and he was getting 10 minutes here and there.
He's awkward, ungainly, clumsy etc and not what you'd call pleasing on the eye but he's also strong, pretty quick, always gives the defenders a hard time and can score a goal when given the chance.
Whenever he scores my heart starts to believe he's maybe an actual player, but then I remember the previous minutes of the match and how he did nothing that benefitted the team and my head takes over.
If he could improve his overall game to just being average he'd be a real asset, it's just the rest outside of streaky scoring patches is not serviceable at this level.
Honestly as much as I've slated the guy he's decent hold up play and learning who to pass the ball to when he does hold it up from being a decent player for us.
I just don't believe the things he lacks can be learnt at this age and stage of career.
For me he stays, just something about the lad, let DCL go to whoever will have him, and try and get a first choice forward who stays fit. I despair and love the guy in equal measure.
For me, Moyes has always been been great with buying midfielders and defenders and hit and miss with forwards, hopefully he buys goals from midfield and and defenders this summer and let’s Beto and whoever chip in with enough.
If either him or DCL are our starting striker next season then we've got problems. I'd rather have Beto as the back-up just because he's more like to change a game and score a goal but realistically if we can get £20m for him then I think we've got to take that.
AjaxAndy wrote: ↑Sat May 10, 2025 6:45 pm
Whenever he scores my heart starts to believe he's maybe an actual player, but then I remember the previous minutes of the match and how he did nothing that benefitted the team and my head takes over.
If he could improve his overall game to just being average he'd be a real asset, it's just the rest outside of streaky scoring patches is not serviceable at this level.
Honestly as much as I've slated the guy he's decent hold up play and learning who to pass the ball to when he does hold it up from being a decent player for us.
I just don't believe the things he lacks can be learnt at this age and stage of career.
I think you just need to let the hatred go, he's never going to be good on the ball, but he gets goals. Not the striker we hoped for but a useful one.
I hope he's not our first choice striker next season, but I'd have him over DCL.
Hope he stays as a squad striker, an option when we play teams with a high line. But for a good fee (30 mil) I'd sell and roll the dice with a younger striker with pace, as well as invest in a main big guy striker.
I think we need three in the squad to be competitive.
I'm not having the nothing that benefits the team thing. He works hard for the team and contributes forward and back. He lacks quality on the ball but he's got some good qualities and if he was happy to be second or third choice I would absolutely keep him around
The Doc wrote: ↑Sat May 10, 2025 7:00 pm
I think you just need to let the hatred go, he's never going to be good on the ball, but he gets goals. Not the striker we hoped for but a useful one.
I hope he's not our first choice striker next season, but I'd have him over DCL.
Hope he stays as a squad striker, an option when we play teams with a high line. But for a good fee (30 mil) I'd sell and roll the dice with a younger striker with pace, as well as invest in a main big guy striker.
I think we need three in the squad to be competitive.
I don't have any hatred for him, seems a lovely guy with a lion's heart. Just too deficient in the basics to be playing at this level which is not his fault but whoever signed off on the deal.
Trying to work out what price he'd be valued at in a world where you pay 15-20 mil for a punt on an unproven Championship player more often than not.
27 year old, so decent age and has shown he can get double digits in the PL. Palace paid 25 rising to 30 for Nketiah (25 year old who never got more than 5 goals and was often a lot less).
I don't think 25 is totally unreasonable especially now he has PL experience. Not sure I'd think it good business with how many failed strikers we've seen of late come into the PL for large fees like Zirkzee or Hojlund and not ask for some bump for a striker who can score.
AjaxAndy wrote: ↑Sat May 10, 2025 7:34 pm
I don't have any hatred for him, seems a lovely guy with a lion's heart. Just too deficient in the basics to be playing at this level which is not his fault but whoever signed off on the deal.
He's playing at this level and has scored some goals. There's strikers who have been in the league years who are doing less, not sure your argument carries.
Silas wrote: ↑Sat May 10, 2025 7:55 pm
He's playing at this level and has scored some goals. There's strikers who have been in the league years who are doing less, not sure your argument carries.
I guess it just depends how you look at his abilities, if you only look at goals then he's doing a premier league level job, but that doesn't paint even a quarter of the whole picture imo.
AjaxAndy wrote: ↑Sat May 10, 2025 8:03 pm
I guess it just depends how you look at his abilities, if you only look at goals then he's doing a premier league level job, but that doesn't paint even a quarter of the whole picture imo.
But goals are the most important currency of all - and the hardest to come by - especially for strikers. DCL is much better at everything else, and yet his goals return is nowhere near.
Our overall play may suffer with Beto leading the line but his goals tally speaks for itself since Moyes has come in. And in a team that has been diabolically poor up front, it's incredibly short-sighted to just dismiss that and place such great emphasis on everything else.
We obviously need to prioritise another striker but, personally, I'd keep both DCL (if the price is right) and Beto, send Broja back and loan out Chermiti for a season. That would give us 3 strikers, all of whom could offer something different, while Chermiti is hopefully getting minutes into his legs.
It's the wings we really need to strengthen, though - that's where teams tend to score most of their goals nowadays.
AllyBlue14 wrote: ↑Sat May 10, 2025 9:07 pm
But goals are the most important currency of all - and the hardest to come by - especially for strikers. DCL is much better at everything else, and yet his goals return is nowhere near.
Our overall play may suffer with Beto leading the line but his goals tally speaks for itself since Moyes has come in. And in a team that has been diabolically poor up front, it's incredibly short-sighted to just dismiss that and place such great emphasis on everything else.
We obviously need to prioritise another striker but, personally, I'd keep both DCL (if the price is right) and Beto, send Broja back and loan out Chermiti for a season. That would give us 3 strikers, all of whom could offer something different, while Chermiti is hopefully getting minutes into his legs.
It's the wings we really need to strengthen, though - that's where teams tend to score most of their goals nowadays.
As someone else said earlier, if you could swap him for someone who has better all round play and hits double figures you'd be far better off.
Also everyone seems to be saying we should keep him but he shouldn't be starting, or sell him because he's not good enough for £25m+. If he was any good people would be arguing to keep him as first choice, but the fact they aren't says everything about the situation.
It's the Beto conundrum, even those arguing for him also say they don't want him playing regularly.
