The NSNO Everton Forums

The other thing is we do seem to have a lot more fight in us these days - not that long ago we'd have folded once they’d equalised once, nevermind twice..

Weird manager.

We have long stretches in every match where we barely look like a PL team but still seem to create the chances we need to win anyway. Even when it feels like we’re getting battered, we still tend to restrict opponents to chances from poor angles or distances (as long as the defenders are paying attention and not dragging people down in the box, which is an admittedly big condition).

I say this all in the nicest way possible. As frustrating as some passages are, it’s nice to not be relying purely on luck every week.

He’s weird but he’s effective.

He has a way of playing and it’s getting results.

I kind of think with the way the game is going these days having someone like dyche is perfect to exploit the way most teams play these days.

Today wasn’t great to watch but we scored three goals away from home and won the game.

On the whole I think we’ve been good to watch under dyche. I don’t care much for possession these days, as long as you’re using the ball to get forward and be effective you’ll win games.

Too many teams playing the same way these days and a lot of struggling with it. I enjoy our direct way of playing as it’s creating chances.

We're basically just trying to not lose once we get a lead... I think his logic is that worst case scenario we pick up a point and they'll add up at the end of the season to be enough, combined with some games we see out for a win, to be comfortably safe.

It's sound logic even if it's hard to watch. His job is to keep us up and stabilise us, and that's why he's shutting up shop and grinding out a win or a draw.

We showed today that if we get pegged back we have another gear to go in to if we concede, so I'm not overly concerned that we could turn a win in to a loss too often doing what we're doing.

I guess it comes down to how pragmatic you're willing to be for this season and probably the next too, because this way of playing is achieving the outcome we all want.

AjaxAndy wrote: ↑Sat Nov 11, 2023 7:19 pm We're basically just trying to not lose once we get a lead... I think his logic is that worst case scenario we pick up a point and they'll add up at the end of the season to be enough, combined with some games we see out for a win, to be comfortably safe.

It's sound logic even if it's hard to watch. His job is to keep us up and stabilise us, and that's why he's shutting up shop and grinding out a win or a draw.

We showed today that if we get pegged back we have another gear to go in to if we concede, so I'm not overly concerned that we could turn a win in to a loss too often doing what we're doing.

I guess it comes down to how pragmatic you're willing to be for this season and probably the next too, because this way of playing is achieving the outcome we all want.

I'm 100% in and all aboard the pragmatism train.

Always have been with Everton and always will be.

I would like to feel less stressed when we go ahead in games. Would like more control.

But I actually enjoy low possession counter football. I don’t mind scrapping either.

I just want to win

I’d rather win 3-2 than 1-0 full control as well tbh

I think it's fair to acknowledge that we've deserved wins in games earlier in the season, and some of the football was decent, so we're due the odd 'dodgy' win like today.

Just to clarify on the possession point, I don't think anyone's asking for or expecting a De Zerbi 65% possession, take the piss out of the opposition style of footie from us, but having games or halves with 20% possession is a bit grim and stark and isn't hugely sustainable.

We've got to do much, much better with the ball because we've got some talented footballers apart from anything else, but still the overall progression and feeling is much more positive.

Highly unlikely that any of the bottom three will reach 30 points at the end of the season, more likely 20, 25 max

We could be safe by the year's end!

Luton will give it a good go because they only usually lose by 1 goal and are in the matches. The other two have no chance.

TheRam wrote: ↑Sat Nov 11, 2023 7:10 pm He has a way of playing and it’s getting results.

I kind of think with the way the game is going these days having someone like dyche is perfect to exploit the way most teams play these days.

Today wasn’t great to watch but we scored three goals away from home and won the game.

On the whole I think we’ve been good to watch under dyche. I don’t care much for possession these days, as long as you’re using the ball to get forward and be effective you’ll win games.

Too many teams playing the same way these days and a lot of struggling with it. I enjoy our direct way of playing as it’s creating chances.

Exactly this !

Get him another CM and a winger he trusts, in Jan. A CB, too.

Bluedylan1 wrote: ↑Sat Nov 11, 2023 6:35 pm Doing well in a difficult situation with limited resources.

Having said that, I'm never going to warm to a manager who tries to play so little football. I find it super hard to watch. Just personal preference.

I can still imagine him saying in 18 months ''there's lots of energy and togetherness and in time, we'd like to add a bit more football to the mix, but there's no substitute for graft and organisation and these fans will not tolerate players who don't work hard'' (or some similar variation of that).

He's fine for the position we find ourselves in at the moment.

I’d say he is better than just “fine” he’s doing exactly what we needed, what was the other option, Bielsa ? Would be certain for the drop by now if we’d taken that route.

Escla wrote: ↑Sat Nov 11, 2023 8:32 pm

Bluedylan1 wrote: ↑Sat Nov 11, 2023 6:35 pm Doing well in a difficult situation with limited resources.

Having said that, I'm never going to warm to a manager who tries to play so little football. I find it super hard to watch. Just personal preference.

I can still imagine him saying in 18 months ''there's lots of energy and togetherness and in time, we'd like to add a bit more football to the mix, but there's no substitute for graft and organisation and these fans will not tolerate players who don't work hard'' (or some similar variation of that).

He's fine for the position we find ourselves in at the moment.

I’d say he is better than just “fine” he’s doing exactly what we needed, what was the other option, Bielsa ? Would be certain for the drop by now if we’d taken that route.

yep about right.

I think what he's done that none of the other managers could consistently do is getting the best out of his players. Mykolenko, Tarkowski, Doucoure, DCL, McNeil, they're all playing as well as they have ever done.

Yes, it is often scrappy, yes, the system falls apart occasionally, losing us control of matches for uncomfortably long periods but so long as the players are playing for him and doing so to the best of their ability, so long as they will create chances even when we rarely have the ball, we can get away with that while those areas are being worked on. He's been talking about changing the story of Everton from the day he came in, to get out on the pitch expecting to win (expecting in a good way, that is), and he's doing a good job in that regard.

Look, we all know what an utter fucking basket case Everton was a year ago, all that will not be magically fixed in a single season while also having to produce results. And there is a good chance fixing everything will prove to be beyond Dyche's abilities as a manager. (This is less a doubt in his abilities and more an acknowledgement of the omnishambles he has had to deal with.) But so far he's on course for me.

Escla wrote: ↑Sat Nov 11, 2023 8:32 pm

Bluedylan1 wrote: ↑Sat Nov 11, 2023 6:35 pm Doing well in a difficult situation with limited resources.

Having said that, I'm never going to warm to a manager who tries to play so little football. I find it super hard to watch. Just personal preference.

I can still imagine him saying in 18 months ''there's lots of energy and togetherness and in time, we'd like to add a bit more football to the mix, but there's no substitute for graft and organisation and these fans will not tolerate players who don't work hard'' (or some similar variation of that).

He's fine for the position we find ourselves in at the moment.

I’d say he is better than just “fine” he’s doing exactly what we needed, what was the other option, Bielsa ? Would be certain for the drop by now if we’d taken that route.

You're right. ''Fine'' is a little bit underselling it. He's done well in a really difficult set of circumstances. He deserves credit, and many more progressive managers might not have coped with the circumstances he came into. Bielsa might actually not be the best example, because he's thrived in a load of different weird situations but your point still stands overall.

Just for full disclosure, I'm never going to be in love with the football. It is what it is. I accept and understand that we're in a period where we just need to avoid crisis, and slowly build back towards being a respectable club again. I accept that it's going to be workmanlike and that we're going to be be better without the ball than with the ball for the most part. Every now and then I will have to complain about the lack of football and us being terrified of the ball, but that not me slaughtering Dyche or wanting him sacked. It's just me voicing a frustration.