Dyche

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Shogun
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brap2 wrote: Sun Feb 04, 2024 1:49 pmPretty much like
Any stats on our xG from open play compared to everyone else in the league?
AjaxAndy
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We create chances that aren't set pieces.

It's just we only seem to score from set pieces.
TheRam
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https://understat.com/team/Everton/2023

Yeah, it’s rubbish that we only create from set pieces.
AllyBlue14
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brap2 wrote: Sun Feb 04, 2024 12:49 pm Is it sustainable, creating chances only from set pieces?
Cos we were carving teams open under previous managers.
Gary1878
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The thing that pisses me off is the comment “all they have got is set pieces”. That was bandied around yesterday by Spurs manager and Sky.

Well, if you actually analyse it, how do you get set pieces in the first place? They don’t just spring out of thin air. You have to have possession and work to get awarded set pieces like free kicks and corners. You have to be able to get the ball up the pitch and cause enough danger that the opponent fouls you or puts the ball out for a corner. And you have to do that enough times to give you a good chance of scoring one of them. It’s not just luck.

I am sure teams like Sheffield Utd would love the amount of set pieces that we get. But the fact is that they aren’t good enough to get them.

Now I’m not saying that we are playing fantastic, freeflowing football. But it is an effective style and you only have to look at our xG in open play to know that we are a half decent team that doesn’t just rely on set pieces.
Jimmywhack
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Escla wrote: Sun Feb 04, 2024 1:40 pm If we go down then in my mind Kenwright, Moshiri and the Premier League will be responsible.
I don't doubt that but no one will remember that
Champagne lifestyle, Lemonade wages
AjaxAndy
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I don't think anyone would remember a relegation as anything to do with Dyche tbh, we'd be 12th without the points deduction.

If we did drop it'd be remembered very much as being because we lost points due to mismanagement at owner and board level.
Shogun
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I'd blame him for having us midtable in the championship though :whistle:
brap2
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TheRam wrote: Sun Feb 04, 2024 2:45 pm https://understat.com/team/Everton/2023

Yeah, it’s rubbish that we only create from set pieces.
Can't argue the numbers tbh but I really don't see it watching us.

It's not a bad thing, it's very very good that we are so effective, I just worry that refs start calling the block as a foul or teams get a bit more wise.

Anyway not sure what the discussion is, I'd be shocked if anyone felt *too* differently: he's doing a great job and is giving us a punchers chance. On pure football terms we should be home and hosed.

I don't think it's egregious to say - there's a huge lack of quality on the pitch, in both the squad and the tactics. Do what we have to do to get over the line, but it would be disingenuous for me to say I either enjoy the football, or that I think it won't be an issue in the long term.

That said, I am grateful to Dyche that he might actually give us a longterm.
AjaxAndy
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brap2 wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 9:51 am Can't argue the numbers tbh but I really don't see it watching us.

It's not a bad thing, it's very very good that we are so effective, I just worry that refs start calling the block as a foul or teams get a bit more wise.

Anyway not sure what the discussion is, I'd be shocked if anyone felt *too* differently: he's doing a great job and is giving us a punchers chance. On pure football terms we should be home and hosed.

I don't think it's egregious to say - there's a huge lack of quality on the pitch, in both the squad and the tactics. Do what we have to do to get over the line, but it would be disingenuous for me to say I either enjoy the football, or that I think it won't be an issue in the long term.

That said, I am grateful to Dyche that he might actually give us a longterm.
I agree with almost all of that, just not the lack of quality in the tactics part... I think there's a hell of a lot of quality in the tactics because he's using what he has to it's absolute potential. He's not asking players to do what they can't, he's not going for style over substance, and it's giving us a chance in games where really we shouldn't have one.

Visually it's not good at this point, we struggle to do much other than battle and be organised, but also when we had everyone fit we played some decent stuff with passing through the lines and everyone's first thought was to pass forward and not always in a direct fashion.

No lack of quality in the tactics, it's just when we don't have a full set of players we don't have the ability to play any other way than to try grind out a draw or sneak a win via a set piece.
brap2
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AjaxAndy wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 10:10 am I agree with almost all of that, just not the lack of quality in the tactics part... I think there's a hell of a lot of quality in the tactics because he's using what he has to it's absolute potential. He's not asking players to do what they can't, he's not going for style over substance, and it's giving us a chance in games where really we shouldn't have one.

Visually it's not good at this point, we struggle to do much other than battle and be organised, but also when we had everyone fit we played some decent stuff with passing through the lines and everyone's first thought was to pass forward and not always in a direct fashion.

No lack of quality in the tactics, it's just when we don't have a full set of players we don't have the ability to play any other way than to try grind out a draw or sneak a win via a set piece.
Yeah I don't mean lack of quality on the tactics to be fair, it's not that the tactics are bad they're fucking great, it's well implemented, team are hard to beat and create a lot of opportunities to bumble one over the line to scrap points it's more....

It's difficult to express because it's not a purely aesthetic thing I'm talking about here, it's not that I just want to watch pretty football because I don't even necessarily think it's that, and I don't think that's the football Everton fans would respond best to, it's that without things like control, possession, pressure with the ball, chance creation from open play, I think you are looking at a very limited part of the game which has a very immediate ceiling on it.

Even if we had a couple of breaks that looked like well worked moves, one twos with someone peeling off...it doesn't look like that, it looks like complete improv with individual decision making letting us down because it's almost like we haven't really prepared to be in this position bearing down on goal.

It's true we're probably still another year again away from worrying about ceilings and progress but without those things I don't think you can be more than just scrappily competitive and I wonder how long scrappily competitive keeps our heads above water. Didn't last forever with Burnley remember.
777Kidnappings
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I must have low standards cos I've enjoyed loads of games this season. As a whole it's been miserable but for me that's down to the off field stuff. I think we've been consistently competitive and created chances. I'm not arsed if we are passing it or shoving keepers into their own nets
4evablu
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The big deciding factor that directs peoples thought process is the league position.
If we were 12th and steady people would be more "happy" and accepting of Dyche and tactics and to a point performance.
However, with the deduction in situ were not 12th and that sways people's opinions...as what they want is not attritional results but positive winning results.
WBFBTPL
MmmBlueBranthwaite
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AllyBlue14 wrote: Sun Feb 04, 2024 4:59 pm Cos we were carving teams open under previous managers.
1st year of the Phenomenal One and under Ancelotti yes,
Farming karma like the Dalai Llama
brap2
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AllyBlue14 wrote: Sun Feb 04, 2024 4:59 pm Cos we were carving teams open under previous managers.
I wouldn't say I liked any of our previous managers, including ancelotti.
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