The NSNO Everton Forums

TheRam wrote: ↑Thu Jul 23, 2026 11:20 pm What do people mean by we’ll be fine?

We’ll avoid going down?

We’ll do better than last season?

It’s a spectrum from Europa League qualification to avoiding relegation somewhat comfortably.

I think where we land on the spectrum depends on two things:

1. The intent we play with. If Moyes emboldens us to play more on the deck, I see a lot of potential for KDH and Hackney to work wide overloads with the wingers and fullbacks. Those triangles have been hallmarks of Moyes’ best footballing teams. If it’s a steady dose of conservatism and lumps into the channel, I see us having enough to stay out of a relegation battle but being somewhat uninspiring like last year.

2. Development of younger players we bought last summer. If even two of Barry/Dibling/Aznou/George/Röhl gain a bit of confidence and grow into their roles in the team, we could end up looking a lot better despite not really doing much in the market this summer. I think if you view the performances of those players as a fixed state, what you’ve already seen is basically what you get, I understand the pessimism. If you think those players looked fairly good under the hood when we bought them and are likely to show even more with a season (or half-season) at Everton under the belts, things don’t look quite as dire despite the lack of action so far.

Lowered expectations are definitely a factor here. We’ve gone from having an expensive squad with no sellable assets and no way of putting a coherent team on the pitch under Moshiri to having a squad that can actually play together with a bunch of young players that can get better and a few legitimate assets that can be cashed in to keep building when needed (Ndiaye and Garner, in particular).

I don’t mind us continuing to focus on young players with big future potential and not pushing more chips in on Moyes, who can’t be trusted to be brave or proactive even when it’s obviously needed. I like our current position.

If we end up at the top end of the spectrum (Europa berth), we can use that to sell the club to a caliber of player we haven’t been able to tempt this summer or last. If we end up at the bottom end, we have a clean break with Moyes, cash in Ndiaye or Garner or both, and bring in someone more exciting and progressive to manage the younger crop we’ve cultivated.

Having said all of that, if anyone thinks the young players we’ve signed are varying shades of not good enough / never going to be good enough, then fair fucks, you’re entitled to your pessimism.

Raptor wrote: ↑Thu Jul 23, 2026 10:11 am Its silly money moves, but its not necessarily by rich clubs, its by intelligent clubs that manipulate the system we just need to get into that way of working that enable you to spend money as you want. Losing players like Branthwaite and Ndiaye should be seen as a mechanism for taking the next step, not necessarily a negative, we need to keep a high level of turnover of talent to grow.

Unless they end up going for top fees, then it is a misstep, whichever way you look at it. If they don't, it actually sets us back.

We often enough sell our top players for under-market rates. Many smarter clubs sell for way above market rates. We bought Mykolenko for almost what we sold Digne for. Not clever.

Branthwaite and Ndiaye are of the quality that makes them instant first teamers for any in the Top 6, (see Stones, Gordon*, Rooney and Barkley) we would be stupid (as we have been to some extent in the past) not to extract premium prices, especially when to the buyer, money is no object.

Garner is not much below that level based on last season. Excellent performance in an average team. If they want him, make them pay a fee that represents the value he is worth to us, taking notice of the market (young english central midfielder, many years on his contract, and with equivalent stats) which is 100m+ apparently.

To us, the loss of a top player is considerable - to the buyer - they're just looking for the last piece in their puzzle. Make them pay.

We've got to value what we own, as well as being smart traders with a solid long term plan.

Why did we sell Rooney for considerably less than what United paid for Veron 3 years earlier? We were mugged off completely. Generational talent Rooney will be the best value purchase by any top club in the modern era (Haaland will probably come close).

It's no good having a solid recruitment plan whilst giving away the fruits of our effort.

Cods wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2026 1:05 am Unless they end up going for top fees, then it is a misstep, whichever way you look at it. If they don't, it actually sets us back.

We often enough sell our top players for under-market rates. Many smarter clubs sell for way above market rates. We bought Mykolenko for almost what we sold Digne for. Not clever.

Branthwaite and Ndiaye are of the quality that makes them instant first teamers for any in the Top 6, (see Stones, Gordon*, Rooney and Barkley) we would be stupid (as we have been to some extent in the past) not to extract premium prices, especially when to the buyer, money is no object.

Garner is not much below that level based on last season. Excellent performance in an average team. If they want him, make them pay a fee that represents the value he is worth to us, taking notice of the market (young english central midfielder, many years on his contract, and with equivalent stats) which is 100m+ apparently.

To us, the loss of a top player is considerable - to the buyer - they're just looking for the last piece in their puzzle. Make them pay.

We've got to value what we own, as well as being smart traders with a solid long term plan.

Why did we sell Rooney for considerably less than what United paid for Veron 3 years earlier? We were mugged off completely. Generational talent Rooney will be the best value purchase by any top club in the modern era (Haaland will probably come close).

It's no good having a solid recruitment plan whilst giving away the fruits of our effort.

When you look at the players then obviously there is a mismatch between Digne and Mykolenko, but the principle was right, sell an older player for 20m - which all gets added to the account that year, and buy Mykolenko for 20m - which is spread over the length of his contract, that enabled us to do the same for other players, turnover is important.

With regards to Rooney we were in a difficult position, yet we managed to get 2.5m less than Veron who was regarded as a world class talent at the time, and if adjusted the Rooney fee is the equivalent of £132m now - so mugged off, im not so sure

brap2 wrote: ↑Thu Jul 23, 2026 9:45 pm Bobble apparently saying not much movement unless we sell an Ndiaye or something similar due to tight money.

Don’t lose your head at every respectable journalist or renowned ITK though come on guys

I mean tbf that's exactly what I said though right? That the way we heavily negotiated the Hackney fee suggests we don't have much money to spend, and that doing business will be tough, hence why there's probably not going to be a lot of business done quickly.

I like literally typed that a page or so ago.

kramer wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2026 12:32 am It’s a spectrum from Europa League qualification to avoiding relegation somewhat comfortably.

I think where we land on the spectrum depends on two things:

1. The intent we play with. If Moyes emboldens us to play more on the deck, I see a lot of potential for KDH and Hackney to work wide overloads with the wingers and fullbacks. Those triangles have been hallmarks of Moyes’ best footballing teams. If it’s a steady dose of conservatism and lumps into the channel, I see us having enough to stay out of a relegation battle but being somewhat uninspiring like last year.

2. Development of younger players we bought last summer. If even two of Barry/Dibling/Aznou/George/Röhl gain a bit of confidence and grow into their roles in the team, we could end up looking a lot better despite not really doing much in the market this summer. I think if you view the performances of those players as a fixed state, what you’ve already seen is basically what you get, I understand the pessimism. If you think those players looked fairly good under the hood when we bought them and are likely to show even more with a season (or half-season) at Everton under the belts, things don’t look quite as dire despite the lack of action so far.

Lowered expectations are definitely a factor here. We’ve gone from having an expensive squad with no sellable assets and no way of putting a coherent team on the pitch under Moshiri to having a squad that can actually play together with a bunch of young players that can get better and a few legitimate assets that can be cashed in to keep building when needed (Ndiaye and Garner, in particular).

I don’t mind us continuing to focus on young players with big future potential and not pushing more chips in on Moyes, who can’t be trusted to be brave or proactive even when it’s obviously needed. I like our current position.

If we end up at the top end of the spectrum (Europa berth), we can use that to sell the club to a caliber of player we haven’t been able to tempt this summer or last. If we end up at the bottom end, we have a clean break with Moyes, cash in Ndiaye or Garner or both, and bring in someone more exciting and progressive to manage the younger crop we’ve cultivated.

Having said all of that, if anyone thinks the young players we’ve signed are varying shades of not good enough / never going to be good enough, then fair fucks, you’re entitled to your pessimism.

I think we’re going nowhere with this version of moyes in charge.

I don’t see much progression with the young players, and think Hackney will struggle to play games.

I think we have the worst defence in the league outside of the promoted clubs and there’ seems to be no desire to improve it. There’s going to be a lot of games with Keane and mykolenko in the same team.

There’s midfield looks really weak to me as well. It gets eaten alive in this era of premier league physicality.

Everyone at the clubs seems happy to just plod along which is a dangerous mindset when you’ve just finished 13th.

Raptor wrote: ↑Thu Jul 23, 2026 5:23 pm I genuinely admire you if you still have belief that this club won't disappoint

If you’re a true blue this club should never disappoint……

If money truly is as tight as the journalists/ITKs are saying then I really don’t understand signing Hackney and George ahead of a right back.

Neither are making the on a weekly basis and were crying out for a RB

Like last summer, it’s a case of getting deals done where we can.

Signing some players, is better than signing no players.

Raptor wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2026 7:24 am When you look at the players then obviously there is a mismatch between Digne and Mykolenko, but the principle was right, sell an older player for 20m - which all gets added to the account that year, and buy Mykolenko for 20m - which is spread over the length of his contract, that enabled us to do the same for other players, turnover is important.

With regards to Rooney we were in a difficult position, yet we managed to get 2.5m less than Veron who was regarded as a world class talent at the time, and if adjusted the Rooney fee is the equivalent of £132m now - so mugged off, im not so sure

£132m - so almost as good as Elliot Anderson?

I remember the financial situation at the time, but 20m upwards with more for certain tranches (and it was certain they'd be acheived, in time) was still highway robbery for one of the game's greatest ever players, certainly England's most talented and effective player in the modern era. Not even a hint of English tax on top.

Rooney was so obviously world class talent at 15, we were definitely had. He should have gone for a world record fee. And it isn't rose tinted specs or Monday's experts. We might not like to talk about what he went on to do - elsewhere.

Veron was a flop in England, I remember many at the time suggested he wouldn't make it (mostly my United mates ). He in fact was the gamble, not the 18 year old certainty.

Digne was, and still is(!) quality, we'd have been well clear of relegation over the last half a dozen years had we kept him (if the finances allowed - which arguably they mightn't if it was such a close run thing).

Myko was untested at this level. Now he's, well, tested.

But anyway, point is, we need to extract the maximum when we're the ones doing most of the gambling. To just survive we need to do this.

The opinion that "oh maybe we'll let Iliman go for 50 and Jarrod for 65" is just crazy based upon current and potential ability, when compared to the market. Every £ needs to work harder here and each one is much more valuable to us than it is the top 6 - where we ultimately want to get to.

I struggle to work out why Moyes was kept on at the end of last season. There's an obvious disconnect in priorities between him and the committee, but it also seems that with the signings of Hackney and George that the committee is winning the power struggle over who to sign.

But fuck me if the club can't sign a right back, even a back up who is a proper RB rather than shoving JOB or Garner out there, then there's fundamental problem in being able to identify and agree on attainable targets. It just shouldn't be this difficult.

Moyes desire of "PL ready" probably rules out a huge amount of the market. And also I imagine that if a target is non-PL experienced, the threshold for quality is substantially higher. So as usual we've limited ourselves to a tiny pool of either PL or unattainable players. It shouldn't be this difficult.

If some of the young players we signed last season had got more chances instead of overplaying certain first teamers, giving minutes to McNeil after we already decided he was leaving or playing Armstrong or Rohl at RM then I'd probably feeling be feeling a bit more positive about them kicking on this season.

It is absolutely baffling.

TheRam wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2026 7:49 am I think we’re going nowhere with this version of moyes in charge.

I don’t see much progression with the young players, and think Hackney will struggle to play games.

I think we have the worst defence in the league outside of the promoted clubs and there’ seems to be no desire to improve it. There’s going to be a lot of games with Keane and mykolenko in the same team.

There’s midfield looks really weak to me as well. It gets eaten alive in this era of premier league physicality.

Everyone at the clubs seems happy to just plod along which is a dangerous mindset when you’ve just finished 13th.

Without wanting to be bigging the Keane / Tarks partnership up (I think it’s horrendous and hope we don’t see as much of it) but only 5 teams conceded less goals than us last season so it’s hardly the worst defence in the league

NickNack wrote: ↑Fri Jul 24, 2026 9:15 am Without wanting to be bigging the Keane / Tarks partnership up (I think it’s horrendous and hope we don’t see as much of it) but only 5 teams conceded less goals than us last season so it’s hardly the worst defence in the league

I was just going to say that, people moan about our defence all the time but even allowing for Branthwaite managing to play a few games we weren't nearly as bad as some people make out.

It only takes a couple of the promoted teams to do well and we could be in the shit again can’t believe we are here again I thought the new stadium was going to be a game changer for us

Another article recommending Troy Parrot for us. As usual we'll miss the boat and panic buy 2 weeks into the season when Toot and Ploot don't score