Dyche - HE'S GONE

[AjaxAndy]

I just don't think we had any viable and affordable solid options for a striker when we signed Beto, the place would have been burnt down if we'd not signed a striker that at least some people had heard of, as the atmosphere around it appeared pretty toxic at the time, whether he fit what we needed or not.

We've certainly not improved up front since, but also like Silva's sacking, what option did the club have? Say we'll go again without an option up front? It bought time, pretty much for free. If it only half worked they would have been happy. Unfortunately it's worked even less than that.

If he's wrong you can't be spending £25m on a player that's not fit for purpose though. We could have just kept Simms and it would have had at worst the same level of impact without committing £25m to a completely unsuitable player.

I genuinely believe Simms, as little as I rated him, would have had the same or better impact.

[Cantoffee]

I think the squad is 15th-17th in the league in terms of quality.

About on par with Wolves/Palace/Bournemouth and maybe slightly worse than Forest/Brentford better than the three promoted teams.

I think we are poor and poorly constructed, still think Dyche is showing no signs of being able to get us above that bottom 3 and we are only there because we've had an easy run to start the season. We will be bottom 3 come the half way mark unless something changes in all the underlying numbers.

[MmmBlueBranthwaite]

Although I wouldn’t even wish Dyche on the team of my worst enemy, I do hope he finds anew jobs straight away. Preferably in January so he can poach illegitimate love child McNeill.

[777Kidnappings]

I just don't think we had any viable and affordable solid options for a striker when we signed Beto, the place would have been burnt down if we'd not signed a striker that at least some people had heard of, as the atmosphere around it appeared pretty toxic at the time, whether he fit what we needed or not.

We've certainly not improved up front since, but also like Silva's sacking, what option did the club have? Say we'll go again without an option up front? It bought time, pretty much for free. If it only half worked they would have been happy. Unfortunately it's worked even less than that.

I agree with all the mitigation but beto has been a disaster. There's loads of mitigation for everyone from the players, to some of the board members, to the manager and the dof. There's loads of mitigation because everyone else has been doing a really poor job too so none of them have had an environment to succeed. I just think most of them have been poor even with the mitigation.

In terms of the dof purely in terms of the 1st team because I've no clue what he's doing in terms of the academy etc.....

[Raptor]

[Shogun]

Love owt like that. 100% bullshit but still love it.

[TheRam]

They usually end in big dunc throttling someone.

[777Kidnappings]

Love owt like that. 100% bullshit but still love it.

Is this the same source who revealed james was transitioning into a lady

[Cods]

If he's wrong you can't be spending £25m on a player that's not fit for purpose though. We could have just kept Simms and it would have had at worst the same level of impact without committing £25m to a completely unsuitable player.

I genuinely believe Simms, as little as I rated him, would have had the same or better impact.

We paid nothing in the first season (because we had nothing) for what on paper was a Serie A level striker. We've not used him, and when we have it's certainly not been to his (perhaps limited) strengths, which is concerning.

I understand why the club did it, but I'm not defending them past the fact we had no money or option otherwise. We can't forget what it would have been like had we not signed a striker. That wasn't ever an option. Simms going ok wasn't palatable to the vast majority, and has this season reverted to an underperforming (per xG) 1 in 4 championship bench-warming striker, so it's probably moot.

The PSR problem was avoided though, and we got in a striker that at the time appeased the fans.

Beto could have been seen by the club as a bit of risk-free back up, suck it and see, he could either adapt to our style, or we to his. Neither have happened though (excepting the first half hour of the last game) which is also a concern.

We might lose a bit on him, but there will be clubs out there who will get something out of him like Udinese did if he suits their style of play. They'll pay a fair chunk.

On Thelwell, from what anyone can tell, it doesn't appear that he's done much beyond the wheeler-dealer and day to day org structure management. On the technical side who really knows, but it doesn't look like we are aiming to play his preferred 3 5 2 formation that he wrote his book on, even if our current squad is probably best suited to playing that formation than most others.

From the outside it all still appears a bit disorganised and dysfunctional.

[Cods]

I agree with all the mitigation but beto has been a disaster. There's loads of mitigation for everyone from the players, to some of the board members, to the manager and the dof. There's loads of mitigation because everyone else has been doing a really poor job too so none of them have had an environment to succeed. I just think most of them have been poor even with the mitigation.

In terms of the dof purely in terms of the 1st team because I've no clue what he's doing in terms of the academy etc.....

Like organisations in financial stress, failing their 'mission statement' and organisational goals, taking their medicine, goalposts moving, failing to function and worsening over a long period, the culture can become bad and nothing seems to click.

A refresh/upturn is needed. And people can be turned around and saved. It's not necessarily throw everyone out and start again. I hope TFG are as good with that as we hear they are, and not as bad with top level management as we're seeing at Roma.

[AjaxAndy]

We paid nothing in the first season (because we had nothing) for what on paper was a Serie A level striker. We've not used him, and when we have it's certainly not been to his (perhaps limited) strengths, which is concerning.

I understand why the club did it, but I'm not defending them past the fact we had no money or option otherwise. We can't forget what it would have been like had we not signed a striker. That wasn't ever an option. Simms going ok wasn't palatable to the vast majority, and has this season reverted to an underperforming (per xG) 1 in 4 championship bench-warming striker, so it's probably moot.

The PSR problem was avoided though, and we got in a striker that at the time appeased the fans.

Beto could have been seen by the club as a bit of risk-free back up, suck it and see, he could either adapt to our style, or we to his. Neither have happened though (excepting the first half hour of the last game) which is also a concern.

We might lose a bit on him, but there will be clubs out there who will get something out of him like Udinese did if he suits their style of play. They'll pay a fair chunk.

On Thelwell, from what anyone can tell, it doesn't appear that he's done much beyond the wheeler-dealer and day to day org structure management. On the technical side who really knows, but it doesn't look like we are aiming to play his preferred 3 5 2 formation that he wrote his book on, even if our current squad is probably best suited to playing that formation than most others.

From the outside it all still appears a bit disorganised and dysfunctional.

Yes we didn't have to pay the first year but we still have to pay £25m for someone who is completely shite, that's yet another millstone around our necks and there's no guarantee anyone will buy him off us for decent money... It's been a monumental waste of both cash and time even if we were able to defer the initial payments.

Would anyone really be able to argue he's achieved more than Simms would have done? I don't think so... I think it's probably pretty even which again just shows what a waste of money he's been.

The whole setup has been a complete mess for years though and it's not easy signing players in the environment he's had to work in... I don't envy his job in the slightest, but I also think when you look at Beto, Maupay, absolutely no pace in the team... He's done a terrible job.

[TheRam]

But simms and Tom cannon who is the better player had to be sold for PSR.

We got around £17m of pure profit from those two and paid nothing for beto.

This is what people aren’t taking into account when it comes to the director of football.

The constant juggling of PSR meaning we’re making ourselves worse in the long term for the sake of short term financial security.

Also wasn’t it revealed that maupay was signed by the board because he had premier league experience.

Seem to remember us being big on Gykores that summer, as well as the guy at dortmund who is smashing it.

If PSR wasn’t an issue and we had an owner with actual money we’d have a much better squad.

Thelwell has just been scrambling around for loans, free transfers and paying on the drip.

He deserves massive credit for building a competitive squad whilst keeping us in line with PSR regulations.

I feel people are using him to try to deflect blame away from dyche.

[AjaxAndy]

But simms and Tom cannon who is the better player had to be sold for PSR.

We got around £17m of pure profit from those two and paid nothing for beto.

This is what people aren’t taking into account when it comes to the director of football.

The constant juggling of PSR meaning we’re making ourselves worse in the long term for the sake of short term financial security.

Also wasn’t it revealed that maupay was signed by the board because he had premier league experience.

Seem to remember us being big on Gykores that summer, as well as the guy at dortmund who is smashing it.

If PSR wasn’t an issue and we had an owner with actual money we’d have a much better squad.

Thelwell has just been scrambling around for loans, free transfers and paying on the drip.

He deserves massive credit for building a competitive squad whilst keeping us in line with PSR regulations.

I feel people are using him to try to deflect blame away from dyche.

It's not a competitive squad though, it's pretty rubbish. Why does everything have to come back to Dyche? It's possible to look at one area of the club without it having anything to do with another.

We failed PSR so selling Simms didn't even get us over the threshold, but yes Thelwell's job has been tough, but he has equally imo built a god awful squad with zero pace and wasted what little money we did have except for Ndaiye who tbf I think was a bit of a bargain.

This opinion has nothing to do with Dyche, it's looking at the job Thelwell has done in difficult circumstances, of which I think he's been poor.

[777Kidnappings]

But simms and Tom cannon who is the better player had to be sold for PSR.

We got around £17m of pure profit from those two and paid nothing for beto.

This is what people aren’t taking into account when it comes to the director of football.

The constant juggling of PSR meaning we’re making ourselves worse in the long term for the sake of short term financial security.

Also wasn’t it revealed that maupay was signed by the board because he had premier league experience.

Seem to remember us being big on Gykores that summer, as well as the guy at dortmund who is smashing it.

If PSR wasn’t an issue and we had an owner with actual money we’d have a much better squad.

Thelwell has just been scrambling around for loans, free transfers and paying on the drip.

He deserves massive credit for building a competitive squad whilst keeping us in line with PSR regulations.

I feel people are using him to try to deflect blame away from dyche.

I think the exact opposite of your last line is true. Suddenly the players are better, suddenly the dof is doing a good job because everything is dyches fault

The same happened with benitez. It's still a widely held opinion that he turned down signing about 70m of players and mykolenko only wasn't a benitez signing in his good season.

Unfortunately at Everton pretty much everything has been at least partly at fault

[TheRam]

You simply can not ignore the restrictions the director of football has had to work around.

Look at the players he’s tried to bring in but not been able to.

We are simply going out there and seeing who can come in that won’t cost much money.

Lindstrom doesn’t suit the manager, and probably isn’t up to the standard from what we’ve seen, but he’s a player with good pedigree who won’t cost us money.

Same with the likes of Danjuma, and Harrison.

I think 80% of the players we’ve signed wouldn’t be here if we let the director of football dictate transfer policy and had money to spend.

And yes, this squad is competitive for what our objective is. The manager is making it look a lot worse than it is by making terrible decisions in team selection.